vt.Buzz ~ a political blog

Political notes from Free Press staff writers Terri Hallenbeck, Sam Hemingway and Nancy Remsen

4.17.2008

Budget bomb-shell

Legislators walked out of a meeting about budget cuts this morning with Douglas administration officials, angry over word that Gov. Jim Douglas is working on a $100 million economic stimulus package they knew nothing about.

"We can't do this," said Senate Appropriations Committee Chairwoman Susan Bartlett, D-Lamoille.

She and other legislative met a short time later with Douglas, but came out of the meeting saying he offered little information. He told them the stimulus package is not ready and that he would clarify his position at his regularly scheduled 1 p.m. news conference, House Speaker Gaye Symington said.

"We've just been blind-sided," Bartlett said. She and other legislators were angry at the notion that Douglas could be considering $100 million in economic development while they are trying to figure out how to salvage program for poor Vermonters from the cuts.

Douglas spokesman Jason Gibbs said the package would not cost $100 million but would generate $100 million in economic growth. It includes some of the governor's previous proposals, most notably his New Neighborhoods housing proposal that the Legislature has largely rejected. That would stimulate $22 million in economic development, according to Gibbs.

Symington characterized that figure as a far-fetched assumption, and said if the governor's economic stimulus package is based on proposals like that, calling it a stimulus package is inaccurate.

"Is this $100 million of a economic stimulus package or a $100 million sham?" Symington asked.

The proposal is a bomb-shell not just to the budget-cutting discussion, but because it comes just two weeks before the Legislature is do to finish its work for the year. The Legislature's own housing bill is in the midst of heated negotiations.

- Terri Hallenbeck

posted by vt.Buzz | 11:51 AM |

Comments:

Douglas is a political whore. He has no ideas. He relies on piss-upons like Gibbs to get him headlines, like the $100 million one this morning. That article has zero substance. It's the grand illusion Douglas seeks, and the press gives it to him (too bad for that). Applause to the Dems for finally showing some backbone. Now if the press would only follow suit and expose Douglas's political charade for what it is--a charade.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:21 PM, April 17, 2008

It wasn't a bomb shell to Louis Porter who had the story in today's TA/Herald.

You should at least give credit to where it was these do-nothing legislators learned "word" of this.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:26 PM, April 17, 2008

The Dems have been critical all year of Douglas for his "lack of vision" so when he has an idea- that details haven't yet been announced- you grandstand and call him a "political whore". It really shows your ignorance when you can criticize something before it is announced. As for the egotistical legislators who were "blindsided" I can only say that they as a majority, have done absolutely nothing to stimulate the economy-only tried to pass bills that will burden taxpayers for year to come. (you are probably not in the private taxpayer column).

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:34 PM, April 17, 2008

The Governor needs to work with the Legislature. He has never wanted to do that.

He says it's a $100 Million package, but there isn't $100 million available to spend.

The guy is a lump.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:37 PM, April 17, 2008

How does a person clarify smoke and mirrors? Guess Jimmy D will show us.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:37 PM, April 17, 2008

Economic stimulus packages are what has made business boom in the South and other parts of the country. Rather than throw money at Railroads to nowhere, bike-paths for the flatlander elite, countless "environmental" agencies whose purpose seems to hinder economic growth (and also serves as make-work employment for liberals), why not buy a man a fishing pole and teach him how to fish? Think what a single auto-parts manufacturer or any other good employer could do for the average working stiff in Vermont?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:01 PM, April 17, 2008

Why wasn't this "stimulus package" in the Governor's budget proposal???

How can the legislature adjourn on time if the governor won't give details of his plans until the week before they want to adjourn??

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:14 PM, April 17, 2008

Yesterday, New York's Democratic Governor David Patterson was in Plattsburgh to announce the opening of a new bus assembly plan that will employ up to 435 people when it is in full operation.

http://www.pressrepublican.com/homepage/local_story_107230037.html?keyword=topstory

There is also a Bombardier rail car assembly plant in Plattsburgh.

Remember when Bombardier used to assemble rail cars in Barre? That plant has been closed for years.

NovaBus, the company that decided to locate in Plattsburgh, chose New York after looking at other states in the Northeast. What do you think they concluded about Vermont?

The Democratic administration in New York State is putting $700 million for economic development into this year's budget.

Unless Vermont starts doing things to encourage businesses to locate in this state, Vermont's economy will continue to decline. This state cannot continue for the long term with tax and regulatory policies that discourage business expansion.

And just wait until after 2012, when Vermont's electric rates, which are now one of Vermont's few competitive advantages, increase substantially - maybe as much as double - when the HydroQuebec contract is renegotiated and Vermont Yankee shuts down. By 2015, IBM might decide to close its Essex plant, putting thousands of Vermonters out of work.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:21 PM, April 17, 2008

It is hard to attract business to Vermont when you have 300+ employees with the Agency of Natural Resources (ANR) protecting the environment and administering ACT 250 ie. trying to keep business out via regulatory permit process and on the other hand the Agency of Economic Development has 20+/- employees trying to attract industry- these odds are hard to overcome. Then we add the business taxes, personal taxes, workers comp, energy cost- it is like paddling upstream!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:33 PM, April 17, 2008

That's inaccurate. There are only a small handful of people working on act 250 and that is one of its problems.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:38 PM, April 17, 2008

I think Symington nailed it on the head.

If we take history into account, the Douglas proposal is probably re-buttered re-heated toast. It's his old bag of PR tricks rolled into one big package and given a new glam rock name.

In his mind, and to those who like alot of butter, the plan will be visionary. To the rest of us, it's merely a sham.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:49 PM, April 17, 2008

We want to grow our funding for social problems, from health care to substance abuse, education from K thur postgraduate but all the time fighting any idea to create sustainable economic growth that will provide the money for all the ideas

kudos to the Governor for continuing to try to lead the way

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:56 PM, April 17, 2008

Nice. A real budget bombshell would be if he proposed to spare our elderly and lower income neighbors from cuts that will have a very real and painful impact, and instead temporarily increase the capital gains tax on people who make $1 million +. Some people can better share the burden than others.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:00 PM, April 17, 2008

We want to grow our funding for social problems ... kudos to the Governor for continuing to try to lead the way"

How is that? By proposing another $100 million program??

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:14 PM, April 17, 2008

Can't wait to see how the press reports on Douglas's clarification of his $100 million pipe dream. Wonder how that went today? I'd pay to watch Douglas's little yes people scrambling around trying to save face for Golly Shucks Jim.

Mike Smith is probably making them sign a pact in blood to right this wrong no matter what the consequences.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:23 PM, April 17, 2008

While wearing hooded robes, no doubt.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:33 PM, April 17, 2008

I have an idea that won't cost anyting but will generate $100 million dollars .....................................................................but I won't tell anyone what it is !!!!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:00 PM, April 17, 2008

In the spirit of my bi-partisan cooperation, I will secretly announce my fantasy $100 million stimulus package on the cover of the Times Argus, and I will deflect any blowback away from me by having my bootlicker Jason have any and all quotes attributed to him. Gotta go. Time to go plug my robot battery in and recharge for my stimulus fantasy tour 2008.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:06 PM, April 17, 2008

"FANTASY STIMULUS PACKAGE"

You nailed it!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:26 PM, April 17, 2008

I have been through ACT 250 and they have the resources of all ANR employees plus the help of Vermont's largest law firm- The Attorney General's office with 89 lawyers!
Not only does ACT 250 have the ANR, they have (sometimes unsolicited) the help of VPIRG, VNRC, Conservation Law Foundation, Vermonters for Responsible Growth, Friends of Prime Agriculture, Open Space advocates, Vermonters for Downtown Development, Friends of Indian Burial Grounds, and then we have local planning zoning and then we have ( if near the water)the Army Corps of Engineers, US Fish & Wildlife, Agency of Transportation, on and on. All above equals $250,000 for permit for a 50,000 sq ft building. Now who wants to move to Vermont?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:37 PM, April 17, 2008

If Douglas is serious about economic stimulus, he'd borrow money this summer, while interest rates are low, to use for rebuilding Vermont's roads and bridges. That would provide work to people in the construction trades who are hurting because of the housing downturn and would improve the state's transportation infrastructure, thus contributing to economic development.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:41 PM, April 17, 2008

That would be good money spent and part of a legitimate stimulus package.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:56 PM, April 17, 2008

"That would be good money spent and part of a legitimate stimulus package."

Perhaps the Governor should have proposed something legitimate as part of his budget ...

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 4:02 PM, April 17, 2008

... but then he'd have to tell someone about the secret plan ...

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 4:27 PM, April 17, 2008

Hey, Gov Doesless proposes to balance the budget by cutting state workers - with no plan, I might add, on how to deal with getting the work done?

Has anybody been to a Jimmy D press conference lately? Last week he had 10 staffers in attnedance -- to listen to Jimmy D pat himself on the back! Just what does his staff really do?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:25 PM, April 17, 2008

they comment on this blog all day long.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:03 PM, April 17, 2008

The only problem the democrats have with this proposal is that they didn't think of it first.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:11 PM, April 17, 2008

What "proposal" ??? There isn't a proposal. There hasn't been a proposal. That's the problem.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:18 PM, April 17, 2008

May 1 ?? 17,16,15........ we'll see

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:35 PM, April 17, 2008

I'm sorry May 1 ??? 17, 18, 19 ....> and they don't know what the other branch is doing at this late date - not good.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:38 PM, April 17, 2008

The housing portion of Douglas's proposal is a sop to Kevin Dorn,
Secretary of Commerce and Community Development and former head of the
Home Builders Association and lobbyist for them in Montpelier.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 6:51 AM, April 18, 2008

NEK' s posts are exactly on target.

1. The legislature should be embarrased for having not proposed anything constructive when they have all the ability to do so

2. Act 250 is costly and a deterrent to new business development. I have had similar experiences trying to expand my business.

3. The Press is as easily availabe to publize a plan by the Dems. Unfortunately the only savings plan proposed by Gaye wasn't a saving plan and was shot down for what it was... a lot to do about nothing.

4. There are a lot of opinions here before having seen a single fact. The reason we can't dig out of the financial hole the state is in is because of Partisan politics, probably not dissimilar to the partisanship going on here.

I am dismayed (but not surprised) that everyone would be so opposed to doing something to strengthen the State economy. There is no sustainable tax base to support our growing economic needs.

Captain America

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 6:52 AM, April 18, 2008

We're not opposed to doing something to strengthen the state economy, we just don't want partisan politics forced on us. The timing of this proposal is very interesting as is the partisan manner in which it was developed and revealed. It also has some interesting perks thrown to Douglas's political and financial backers.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:34 AM, April 18, 2008

I think partisanism is being played on both sides of the aisle. We can have our opinions on who started what but I think there is enough blame to go around to all parties.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:38 AM, April 18, 2008

Just read Porter's summary of what Jim Douglas didn't say yesterday about his fantasy stimulus package. Lot of "you'll see" and "that's forthcoming" but absolutely NOTHING as far as details. Douglas is vapid and my guess is he's stalling for time to try and save face. Sweep the bums out in November. I don't care who the opposition is, he or she has my vote.

Oh BTW, I saw that Bush wants to nullify a Vermont judge's ruling on air pollution. Wonder if Douglas can use his Bush campaign manager status (2x) to get him to back off. Yeah right.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:37 AM, April 18, 2008

Sure, it would be nice to stimulate the economy, but we can't do ANYTHING to ruffle the feathers of the ACT250 commissars or the out-of-state lawyers at CLF. Let the working stiffs eat cake.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:59 AM, April 18, 2008

Let's compare Douglas's stimulus package to the Dems stimulus package- oh I forgot- the Dems don't have one but Douglas's is far worse!!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:29 AM, April 18, 2008

Douglas doesn't have one either, according to everything I've read NEK. I guess you could say it's a fair comparison. When you have a valid point, post it.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:33 AM, April 18, 2008

ditto!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:40 AM, April 18, 2008

Bubba, even in your role as defender of every stupid idea to come down the pike that happens to fall into the repubican or conservative category, you'll have to admit that the timing of the so-called stimulus package that Douglas plans is pretty suspect. It was obvious last fall that the economy was tanking but Douglas did nothing. He knows very well that it's too late to craft anything meaningful now and Act 250has nothing to do with it. He is actually hoping the legislature will walk away from his stimulus plan so he can use it as a divisive issue in his re-election campaign. It's unfortunate that Douglas has chosen to surround himself with people who are all politics all the time, policy be damned. That's where this bogus stimulus idea comes from. It's the same kind of thinking that has proven so disasterous for George Bush, who Douglas says he admires so much. Unfortunately, the leadership in the statehouse didn't anticipate this kind of political manipulation when they sat down to look at budget cuts with Douglas's people, all of whom had to know this was in the works when they were looking the Democrats in the eye. It recalls that great line from the film "animal house" in which Otter says "Flounder, you can't spend your whole life worrying about your mistakes! You f***ed up - you trusted us!"

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 10:24 AM, April 18, 2008

Didn't that Tringe woman come out of Camp Bush? She now advises Douglas and probably had her hand in this political game somewhere. Karl Rove teaches his children well (and they are children).

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 10:34 AM, April 18, 2008

I cannot believe how someone can get sooo worked up because the Governor has a positive idea and they don't. Who cares about the timing- it does not/should not impact spending. Any stimulus package takes time to implement although some would expect results by Monday. The spending needs to be addressed immediately.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 11:38 AM, April 18, 2008

The best thing Vermont could do is to repeal ACT250 in it's entirety and leave ALL zoning in local control, as it once was. What is there to lose? We can't sink any lower, so why not give it a try? If disaster occurs, vote it back in! Picture Vermont without CLF lawyers snooping around, without layers of "environmentalists" telling people what they can or cannot do! Picture the unemployed leftists heading down I95 in their Volvos like a bunch of 30's Okies looking for the promised land! WIN-WIN-WIN!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:15 PM, April 18, 2008

Jim Douglas knows more about what Vermonters want and need than all the Dimocrats put together

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:58 PM, April 18, 2008

Vermonters need aliveable minimum wage.

If a business cannot pay its lowest paid emplyees at least $12 per hour for a single person and $16 per hour for a married employee then maybe they shouldn't be in business.

I have been working at a minimart for 3 months for $8 and hour while gas is selling for close to $3.50 a gal. I don't know where the profit is going but it is not to the workers at the bottom of the line

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:06 PM, April 18, 2008

Everyone laughs at how many personal appearance Douglas makes but it gives him access to the citizens of the state to hear what they think and say.

I don't see the same effort being put forth by Shumlin, Gaye or any of the other leaders to do the same.

Why is that so troubling to you lefties? Is it an elitist thing?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:07 PM, April 18, 2008

"Vermonters need aliveable minimum wage.

If a business cannot pay its lowest paid emplyees at least $12 per hour for a single person and $16 per hour for a married employee then maybe they shouldn't be in business"

With all due respect, try something a little different. Take responsibility for your life. Go apply for better paying jobs...Get job training so you have a marketable skill. Go back to college and get your degree.

If you want a better life, you have to make it happen. The government can not legislate your prosperity. That's the American way.

You can be a victim only if you want and if you want you will work in the minimart the rest of your life.

Captain America

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:15 PM, April 18, 2008

1:06 has been listening to Bernie Sanders too long. No matter what Brooklyn Bernie tells you, there really is NO free lunch. (Well, maybe the free lunches you'll get if you listen to Bernie in Danville or Bradford this week)

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:35 PM, April 18, 2008

Thinking about 1:06 and your post, Bubba, do you think Bernie has any oil and gas stocks in his retirement portfolio or does he demonstrate the social responsibility to invest in a manner consistent with the policies he endorses?

You don't think he is benefiting personally from collusion between Big Oil and Bussh/Cheney do you?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:51 PM, April 18, 2008

Why, of course not! No more than the portfolios of the leftist trustfunders that have invaded Vermont for the last 30 years!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:21 AM, April 19, 2008

"Is this $100 million of a economic stimulus package or a $100 million sham?" Symington asked.

Doesn't she know the answer to her own question? Cripes, she is the Speaker of the House! Shouldn't she know if it is real or not and have a fact-based position on it?
All she is doing here is stirring the pot of partisan politics.

C'mon Gaye. Have a spine and take a stand. Either you support it or you don't. Right now it looks like you are on the sidelines until you can understand if it is a popular proposal so yo can line up on the winning side.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:42 AM, April 19, 2008

Let's review the last time we went through this exercise:

1) Douglas proposes budget;

2) Democrats and Progressives spend a week or so in the media trashing it;

3) Democrats and Progressives refuse to put forward their own plan, instead pleading with the governor to "sit down with them" and share any criticism of their plan, and blasting him for "not showing leadership" when he refuses to walk into that trap.

So now with Vermonters reading in the papers about a pending economic/fiscal problem coming down the tracks, Douglas beats the Democrats/Progressives to the punch and gets his stimulus plan out there first.

How many people think that if Shumlin and Symington could have put together something faster and called a press conference to announce their own stimulus plan first, they wouldn't have? And criticized Douglas for "not showing leadership?"

In this day and age when expectations for activist government have been set so high that people expect government to solve every problem for them, you have to propose something for everything that comes up, just to show you care.

Don't believe me? Read this story about the City of Burlington giving free paint to homeowners making $39,550 a year so they can put a new coat of paint on.

http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080418/NEWS/80418021

If Douglas invites Shumlin and Symington to his office, says, "Let's work together on a stimulus package," and offers them an outline, you don't think they take it back to their offices, have their staff mark up the parts they hate with red ink, then call reporters in to rip "the Governor's plan" and say they'll fix it?

I mean, the Times Argus reports Pollina jumped Douglas and put his stimulus plan out there this morning. Did he do it on the back of an envelope Friday night? Who cares? He slammed the Democratic leadership for not putting their own on the table:

"… They should take themselves out to the woodshed and ask some hard questions about why it is that they don't have an economic stimulus plan," Pollina said. "I think the legislators should have taken the time to sit around the table and anticipate the problem and say 'We have a plan to move our economy forward.' They don't have to react to the current governor."

Right on, Anthony. At least you put one out there, albeit one full of tax hikes.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:59 PM, April 19, 2008

A liveable wage would immediately put hundreds of thousands of dollars in the economy, now that is a stimulus package!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:00 PM, April 21, 2008

A livable wage - i.e., a left wing way of paying people more than they're worth would only drive business out of state. With a little gumption and hard work any one can be making a "livable wage". Besides, a lot of these people don't want to get off the welfare gravy wagon anyway.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:56 PM, April 21, 2008

Let me give you a clue.... if you want to get a livable wage, get the skills you need to earn it.

Running a cash register in a mini-mart shouldn't be a career goal.

However, there are industries that pay more than a livable wage and offer benefits to boot but us Vermonters don't want them carpetbaggers here in our State. We would rather exist in an economy of bed and breakfasts, maple sugar houses and dairy farming....all great businesses but all paying minimum wages.

We have gotten exactly what we asked for. Happy?

Captain America

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 5:38 PM, April 21, 2008