vt.Buzz ~ a political blog

Political notes from Free Press staff writers Terri Hallenbeck, Sam Hemingway and Nancy Remsen

11.12.2007

Pollina tosses his hat

As you may have read on an inside page of the Free Press Sunday, Anthony Pollina told members of the Vermont Progressive Party that he would be a candidate for governor in 2008.

I've already seen some commentary that suggests Republican Gov. Jim Douglas won't have any trouble being re-elected because Pollina and whichever Democrat runs will split the vote on their end of the political spectrum.

We'll be adding to this discussion, but let the chat begin on the obvious first question -- whether Douglas and his strategists are breathing easy today? And are Democrats with packing up their gubernatorial political ambitions for 2010?

-- Nancy Remsen

posted by vt.Buzz | 9:18 AM |

Comments:

Douglas knows he doesn't have to do anything to keep his job. He's kept his options open on clean air, consolidation, and the income tax.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 11:12 AM, November 12, 2007

Yeah, Douglas sure has kept his options open -- he damns the legislature with soundbites and no solutions - that really work!

Jim Douglas lacks vision - unless it has to do with his re-election.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 11:21 AM, November 12, 2007

Gov. Douglas, although not the conservative Vermont needs to clean house, has done a decent job when you look at what he has to put up with in the house and senate. Too bad Vermont can't give him a conservative legislature to back some of his ideas. As for Pollina, he is just another left-wing joke with no chance of being elected, even in liberal Vermont. I'm afraid nothing much will change; Douglas will win in a landslide, and the same morons will be elected house and senate leaders. And Doug Hoffer will still be blogging everywhere about how wonderful everything is in "progressive" Vermont!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 11:21 AM, November 12, 2007

As a strong and dedicated Democrat, I am distressed about this upcoming election. Jim Douglas is almost assured of reelection, and especially if Pollina gets in.

Yet the Dems have put noone forward so far.

I can't vote for Pollina - I would be as concerned about him winning as I am about Douglas.

Pollina has no credentials for Governor.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 11:24 AM, November 12, 2007

Pollina is probably the strongest candidate to run against Douglas in 08, even though Douglas is almost sure to be re-elected.

Pollina can speak to the concerns of working Vermonters in a way that many Democrats (especially Symington and Shumlin) cannot. Pollina will be strong on issues related to the economy, health care, and the future of VT agriculture. These are the issues Jim Douglas emphasizes, so it would be good to have both candidates for governor talking about the same things.

A Democratic candidate would talk more about global warming, the Iraq War, and impeachment. Those issues would go over well among the trust-fund Democrats in Charlotte, Shelburne, and Norwich but not in the Northeast Kingdom. In 2002, Pollina came in ahead of Shumlin in the NEK. Pollina will actually get some "heritage Republican" votes, voters that don't find Dems from Windsor or Windham counties particularly attractive candidates.

The goal of Douglas' opponents should be to keep his vote share below 55 percent in 08, so that as Vermonters tire of him over the years, he would be more vulnerable to defeat in 2010, when one of the current Democratic statewide officeholders might have the guts to run against him.

Even if the Dem leadership doesn't support the Pollina campaign, Pollina should enter the Democratic primary and try to get the Democratic as well as Progressive labels on the November 08 ballot. He might actually win such a primary - the Democratic leadership, not Pollina, are the potential "spoilers" in this campaign.

The Dems' price for supporting Pollina for Gov should be an agreement by the Progs that there will be no Prog candidate for Lt Gov in 2008.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 11:47 AM, November 12, 2007

"Pollina has no credentials for Governor."

who does? Douglas has proven he doesn't have what it takes.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 11:58 AM, November 12, 2007

Has Pollina ever run for any local or state office and won?

Bernie never made progress on the state level until after he was elected mayor of Burlington. Hey Anthony, how about running for Middlesex selectboard first?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:48 PM, November 12, 2007

Will Pollina try to take away our SUV's like Douglas is doing?

I'm starting to wonder if it's time for Douglas to join the "progressive" party.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:43 PM, November 12, 2007

Is Douglas taking away your SUV's or just making the appearance that he is in order to appeal to a particular political group?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:45 PM, November 12, 2007

Which is better?? taking away my right to drive what I want to?

Or lying about your position to score political points?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:30 PM, November 12, 2007

I wonder how many Democrats can forgive Pollina's incessant criticism of the party during his gubernatorial and lite gov. runs. His favorite stump speech tag line was about how "the gap between the rich and poor is growing. The gap between management and workers is growing. The gap between everything in Vermont is growing except the gap between the Republican and Democratic Parties."

That kind of holier-than-though rhetoric was something Clavelle didn't have to reconcile; Pollina will.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:39 PM, November 12, 2007

What's a better outcome for the Democrats? To have both John Campbell and Pollina on the ballot, with each of them getting 20-25 percent and Douglas over 50, or to have Pollina as the only alternative to Douglas, with Douglas winning 55-45?

Matt Dunne should consider sitting out the 08 cycle, unless Dubie decides not to run for re-election, in which case Dunne could run for Lt Gov. Or if Campbell runs for Gov, Dunne could run for his old Senate seat from Windsor County. Losing two statewide races in two years would be damaging to Dunne's future prospects.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:27 PM, November 12, 2007

This is the best thing for the Dems. It gives them a clean "out" of the 2008 election, which they wouldn't be able to win anyway. Now they accomplish two things:

1) Have an excuse not to run a credible challenger against Douglas (we can't run someone and its all the Progs fault).

2) Prove that Anthony Pollina (and by extension, the Prog party in general) is a waste of space - A Pollina loss will force him to retreat from all future races, and will make the progs think twice before ever running anyone for statewide office.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:54 PM, November 12, 2007

"1) Have an excuse not to run a credible challenger against Douglas"

How did Anthony become a "CREDIBLE CHALLENGER"

His only gift is gab!

Somehow the Progs think he has earned the right to run for Governor -- or is this more about the Progs running a statewide candidate so they get the requisite % of voters to maintain major party status?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 4:19 PM, November 12, 2007

Mission Accomplished!!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 4:24 PM, November 12, 2007

Just my two cents, but did anybody catch the CAX video of Dorky Jim eating breakfast at hunting camp? Can you imagine hunting with Douglas? "Let me tell you about the Vermont way forward". or "Let me tell you about the time I went hunting with the Mexicans who worked on my brother's farm". Douglas had this vest on in the clip that you know someone told him "looks kind of hunty Jim". I'd like to see Douglas shoot a 12 gauge. It'd kick back and he would fall down. Big Dork Jim. We keep electing him.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 4:52 PM, November 12, 2007

Can you imagine hunting in Peter Shumlin's shorts?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 5:31 PM, November 12, 2007

"Let me tell you about the time I went hunting with the Mexicans who worked on my brother's farm".

That's a pretty clumsy effort to smear the Governor, and you didn't even get the facts right. The immigrant workers worked on his wife's brother's farm.

But it's an interesting study in the double standard accorded politicians of different stripes in this state. Douglas' brother in law has potentially undocumented aliens working on his farm and the headlines read: "Governor's relative employs illegals." Gaye Symington's employer violates environmental laws, but the media don't even mention her name until the state GOP head points it out, then dismiss it as a political attack.

Go figure.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 6:28 PM, November 12, 2007

Symington's employer got a minor citation regarding the composting of some of their garden waste.

That's no comparison to hiring illegal aliens, violating the the social security, minimum wage and tax (state and federal) laws and hiring Mexicans instead of Vermonters.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 6:58 PM, November 12, 2007

"Symington's employer got a minor citation regarding the composting of some of their garden waste."

Sorry, that doesn't pass the straight face test.

From the Burlington Free Press, 10/07/07:

"No longer can the operation be classified as agriculture, the District Environmental Commission ruled in May. As a commercial enterprise, it needs a state Act 250 land-use permit. Because the Intervale was once an Abenaki settlement and is believed to be replete with artifacts, that permit will require an archaeological survey and proof that the operation will not adversely affect the artifacts. The process could be long and expensive, with an uncertain outcome.

Then, two weeks ago, came another challenge: The state issued a list of alleged environmental violations against the compost program, including improper storage of liquid runoff, accepting too much food waste and spreading leachate without a permit. The center is fighting some of the allegations, but is scrambling to control the runoff. If it fails to do that, the compost operation could have to shut down by July.

Thus, the good stewards of the earth have been accused of endangering the earth. It's an awkward position for the Intervale Center and raises questions about whether the lowlands along the river can support such an operation."

Somehow I doubt you'd think operating a business for years without an Act 250 permit; improperly storing potentially hazardous liquid; violating solid waste storage regulations; and potentially damaging archeological sites would be "minor" if they were perpetrated by a for-profit corporation that didn't have major ties to the Democratic Party.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:36 PM, November 12, 2007

We just need a new speaker.

Let Pollina have his run at it.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:57 PM, November 12, 2007

Pollinas Ok.

But I think we need a new Attorney
General - How about T J Donovan?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:00 PM, November 12, 2007

"'When you get in bed with the Democratic Party you find yourself
having to work with people whose views are diametrically opposed
to my views,' he [Bernie Sanders] said." (Rutland Herald, 7/30/88)

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:25 PM, November 12, 2007

Oh, come on. You know that you can't quote Bernie and expect to hold him to his word. Bernie will say anything to get elected enough to collect a pension and screw Vermont in the process.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:28 PM, November 12, 2007

Pollina is far-left socialist who has always loathed Gov. Democrats--so much so he ran against Dean in 2000. No real Democrat can support Pollina. No way. Now how.

"In 2000, Anthony Pollina ran on the Progressive Party ticket against Dean in the gubernatorial race getting close to 10 percent of the vote...Far from being the lesser-evil in Vermont, Dean was the evil that many working and poor people in Vermont felt very tangibly. Illusions in Dean and the Democrats as a lesser-evil to the Republicans only served to mute the necessary struggles that were needed to fight against his right-wing policies. (International Socialist Review, www.isreview.org)

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:30 PM, November 12, 2007

Any Democrat who supports Pollina, after what he did in the Lt. Gov.'s race in woow, is a traitor to the Party.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:38 PM, November 12, 2007

Impeach Pollina!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 10:58 PM, November 12, 2007

Sorry: after what he did in 2002.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:44 AM, November 13, 2007

Pollina should not EVER ge the Democratic nomination after screwing Shumlin out of the lt. governor's seat.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:13 AM, November 13, 2007

Shumlin is such a liar. It's hard to imagine anyone cares that he lost.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:38 AM, November 13, 2007

Pollina did Vermont a lot of favors by keeping Shumliar out of the lt. Governor's office.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:54 AM, November 13, 2007

What the hell is Pollina running on is the real issue. Informing your inner circle every day about your issues and positions doesn't help those of us out here who don't know what your platform is. I'm assuming energy and dairy will be paramount, but you better get on your horse and start Paul Revering your ass all over Vermont. Call it a "engagement tour" as opposed to a "listening tour." Jim Douglas is just dialing it in any more.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:15 AM, November 13, 2007

As a committed Democrat, I could never vote for Pollina after he trashes trashes Dems, says we are just as bad as the GOP, and cost us the election for Lt Gov in 2002.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:45 AM, November 13, 2007

At this point with no Dem candidate, one can conclude the dems are clueless. There is not even an informal "de facto" candidate. Maybe thats why Pollina jumped in. The dems are waffling and have no confidence, which is exactly why the dems lose each election.

If the dems get thier act together and prop up a cardboard candidate, the vote will be divided and Douglas will win. He may not get 50%, but that won't matter. If the dems rally behind Pollina, there is a small unlikely chance that Pollina would win. I guess the questions is do the dems want to work with Pollina, because they certainly are not working with Douglas.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 10:31 AM, November 13, 2007

Do you think it's the Democrats who aren't working with Douglas, or just some of the leadership?

I get the feeling Gaye would really work with the Administration to make progress on some issues for the benefit of Vermont if she could.

But Shumlin and the party leadership don't want to give Douglas anything he can claim even partial credit for because they're only interest is in unseating him.

Since anything Gaye does has to go through the Senate and Shumlin, she's got to work with him, even if he routinely scores political points at her expense.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:33 PM, November 13, 2007

The Democratic leadership has bent over backwards to give Douglas 90% of what he's asked for.

It's Douglas who hasn't worked with the legislature.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:46 PM, November 13, 2007

It doesn't matter who is to blame. Either the dems want status quo with Douglas or they want to try Pollina.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:10 PM, November 13, 2007

Jim Douglas has a "my way or the highway" metality.

It really is too bad - but he has to satisfy his right wing conservative base.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:23 PM, November 13, 2007

Interesting perspective on the troubles with the Progs...

http://www.vermonttiger.com/content/2007/11/vermont-progres.html#more

It's tough to believe the Dems can't offer up something more substantial. Clearly, from this and other threads, there is no love loss for Douglas. I can't believe candidates aren't just lining up to run against him.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:56 PM, November 13, 2007

www.LookAtMeLookAtMeLookAtME.com

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:40 PM, November 13, 2007

I hope Pollina doesn't betray the Progressives and run as a Democrat. He'll lose all his credibity with me.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:56 PM, November 13, 2007

Re-election of Douglas shows the complacency of the Vermont voter.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:04 PM, November 13, 2007

"Re-election of Douglas shows the complacency of the Vermont voter."

...or perhaps the true voter's overall satisfaction in his job performance.

Maybe this board is not so representative of all 600,000 people in the state.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:33 PM, November 13, 2007

"Jim Douglas has a "my way or the highway" metality.

It really is too bad - but he has to satisfy his right wing conservative base."

You really think so? I think it's the other way around -- the Democrats have to kowtow to their left wing liberal base because they actually have somewhere to go: They can vote Progressive.

Look at Douglas' positions on social issues. They're not much different than Howard Dean's. Same goes for the environment and health care. The right wing may not love his stances on abortion, civil unions, etc. but they don't have anywhere to go. There's no right wing version of the Progressives.

Look at last session. What issues did the Dems spend their time on? Impeachment, the Iraq War, Cindy Sheehan, Death With Dignity, and Global Warming.

Who's trying to satisfy their base?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:39 PM, November 13, 2007

Actually it was a REPUBLICAN Senator who had Cindy Sheehan speak at the statehouse.

Nice try though.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:42 PM, November 13, 2007

It's also a REPUBLICAN Rep. (Richie Westman) who has been the most enthusiastic about raising the gasoline tax.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:42 PM, November 13, 2007

If anyone seriously thinks Vince Illuzi is anything other than a RINO then I've got a bridge for sale in Brooklyn. Now that even northeast Vt. is becoming more leftist, so will shylock Illuzi. This man has almost as few principles as Shumlin or Sanders.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:53 PM, November 13, 2007

You'll need to take that up with Illuzi. One thing's for certain, he's carried a lot of water for the VT GOP over the decades.

Westman's worked hard for the VT GOP too. So, next time you're complaining about regressive taxes, think of Rep. Westman and his proposals to raise the gas tax.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 4:11 PM, November 13, 2007

"You really think so? I think it's the other way around -- the Democrats have to kowtow to their left wing liberal base"

You make an interesting point. I wonder if Douglas were a Dem would there be as much noise about his performance as Gov? He really is not so much different than Dean.

It's tough to make progress at a state level when there is so much unproductive time wasted on national issues we can't affect. Global warming, Cindy Sheehan, Iraq, it all seems a little like debating motherhood and apple pie. That's what Leahy, Welch and Sanders are paid to address.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 4:19 PM, November 13, 2007

Jim Douglas comes in to work every morning, puts down his coat and then listens as Mike "Inch-High" Smith tells him what he's going to be working(??) on today. Douglas is so not driving this train. It's silly to think he is. He is the squeaky clean figurehead for Slimy Smith and his little boy crew. This kind of politics has got to go. Pollina, Galbraith, who the F cares. Just somebody to knock out this junta.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 4:59 PM, November 13, 2007

Douglas's campaign bumpersticker for '08:

Jim Douglas '08
Politics over Policy

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 5:27 PM, November 13, 2007

"Douglas is so not driving this train. It's silly to think he is. He is the squeaky clean figurehead for Slimy Smith and his little boy crew."

Another conspiracy uncovered and it makes perfect sense. The devious M. Smith that wants to be Gov isn't so he finds a way into a job with the guy elected by the populus, brainwashes him and then uses him now as a pawn in his evil scheme to control the doings in the great State of VT.

Yup. Logical. Makes perfect sense.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 5:48 PM, November 13, 2007

"He is the squeaky clean figurehead for Slimy Smith and his little boy crew"

The name calling plays nicely off points made in the Vermont Tiger article referenced in an earlier post.

From the article:
"I observed that the Progressives live by three memes. First and foremost is Protectionism.

The second theme is that for Progressives, politics is personal. Winning is never about the triumph of a set of ideas. It’s about victory of the party, people, and players.

Lastly, is the pervasive anti-intellectualism among Progressives. The rare question of fact or policy brings on a personal attack."

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 5:58 PM, November 13, 2007

"Shumlin is such a liar. It's hard to imagine anyone cares that he lost."

Maybe true. But that still does not excuse Pollina for spoiling the race and handing the Lt/ Gov's seat to a Republican.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:44 PM, November 13, 2007

"You'll need to take that up with Illuzi. One thing's for certain, he's carried a lot of water for the VT GOP over the decades."

Vince carries water for anyone he thinks will be able to help him down the line. And get himself some media coverage in the process.

That includes Republicans, Democrats, Progressives, Liberty Unions, Whigs, Tories, Communists, Socialists, and the Legalize Marijuana Party.

Vince is a party of one: the Vince Illuzzi Party.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:38 PM, November 13, 2007

"The rare question of fact or policy brings on a personal attack"

Nobody here has been attacked as much as Doug Hoffer.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:34 PM, November 13, 2007

Nobody here SHOULD be attacked as much as Doug Hoffer. A paid shill for the wing nuts of the far left with absolutely NO credibility!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 5:59 AM, November 14, 2007

I also think mean people suck.

Let's get past the Can'ts and get to what can be done.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:56 AM, November 14, 2007

Bubba,
Attack his positions and his arguments -- that's great.

But people here attack him personally. That seems to be something the right wing does a lot -- the left does it too -- but not as much as the right.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:39 AM, November 14, 2007

Do you mean both of the right wing bloggers here or the 500 lefties?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:27 AM, November 14, 2007

"Anonymous said...
"The rare question of fact or policy brings on a personal attack"

Nobody here has been attacked as much as Doug Hoffer."

-Posted by Doug.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 11:50 AM, November 14, 2007

Bubba said, "Nobody here SHOULD be attacked as much as Doug Hoffer."

That just goes to prove that the right wingers dependence on attacking others and their anti-intellectual nature.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:03 PM, November 14, 2007

Come on Democrats lets see a candidate for Governor.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:27 PM, November 14, 2007

Once again, Pollina, not content with merely inflicting the likes of Brian Dubie on the State of Vermont, decides to provide the gift that keeps on giving to Jim Douglas.

Lucy Jim.

Lucky us.

Spare me the sanctimonious "Pollina will fight the good fight" slop.

That's not the issue. Pollina's candidacy will only help the Gops and hurt the Dems. That's his history. That's Vermont's reality.

This is not about how things should be, this is about how things are. Pollina's sole contribution to Vermont Politics is Brian Dubie.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 7:57 PM, November 16, 2007

Aw, c'mon. He really cares for the little people. You know, the ones who serve him his coffee.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:34 AM, November 17, 2007

So much brain-dead-bubba BS, so little time.

While I've grown accustomed to the factually-challenged feces and take back Vermont trash comprising the Bush/Douglas shtick and the ever-dwindling membership of their coalition of the clueless supporters.

For example:

bubba said... Gov. Douglas, although not the conservative Vermont needs to clean house, has done a decent job when you look at what he has to put up with in the house and senate. Too bad Vermont can't give him a conservative legislature to back some of his ideas."

Well, bubba, that's your ignorant, ill-informed, factually-challenged opinion and you're as entitled to it as I am to shred it with the facts.

If the likes of Jim Douglas isn't sufficiently clueless or conservative enough for ya, feel free to back the likes of Ruth Dwyer or Clueless McLaughry at the Making Ethan Allen Turn Over in His Grave Institute. After all, they sure put an end to Howard Dean's Reign as Governor of Vermont in the '90s a decade or so ago, now didn't they?

And while I hate to add to your already insurmountable burden, like the US Dollar, it doesn't look like Gay-Bashing has lost much of its value so I wouldn't count of the Homophobia Cavalry to bail you out this time. Bummer.

But, hey, feel free to dredge up another Dwyer or Clueless McLaughry Clone. There's nothing Vermont needs more than a wing-nut counterpart to Anthony Pollina to put Vermont out of its misery by driving a stake through Jim Douglas's political heart.

After all, as gops go, his shouldn't be too hard to find.

Please, go on: "As for Pollina, he is just another left-wing joke with no chance of being elected, even in liberal Vermont. I'm afraid nothing much will change; Douglas will win in a landslide, and the same morons will be elected house and senate leaders. And Doug Hoffer will still be blogging everywhere about how wonderful everything is in "progressive" Vermont!"

So, what you're saying is that the Dems can't come up with a candidate to beat the Political Juggernaut that is Jim Douglas while the wing-nut, Real Vermonter likes of you and your Coalition of the Clueless compatriots can't muster up a competitive challenge to the lackluster leadership of the comedy team of Shumlin and Symington, eh?

I commend you on your firm grasp of the obvious. Clearly, you put a lot of "thought" into it.

I'll let Mr Hoffer speak for himself. As plentiful ast they are, I wouldn't dream of depriving him of an opportunity to rip your metaphorical head off with the facts. You certainly seem like the sort of fella that will provide us all with ample opportunities.

In your future posts, feel free to actually try. It'd be nice to actually break a sweat for a change while I'm breaking the "arguments" of the likes of you.

You can show yourself out.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 11:05 AM, November 17, 2007

"This man has almost as few principles as Shumlin or Sanders.
# Posted by: bubba | 3:53 PM, November 13, 2007"

Not to worry, Bubba. Your lead is safe.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 11:17 AM, November 17, 2007

Anonymous said...
Pollina is far-left socialist who has always loathed Gov. Democrats--so much so he ran against Dean in 2000. No real Democrat can support Pollina. No way. Now how.

"In 2000, Anthony Pollina ran on the Progressive Party ticket against Dean in the gubernatorial race getting close to 10 percent of the vote...Far from being the lesser-evil in Vermont, Dean was the evil that many working and poor people in Vermont felt very tangibly. Illusions in Dean and the Democrats as a lesser-evil to the Republicans only served to mute the necessary struggles that were needed to fight against his right-wing policies. (International Socialist Review, www.isreview.org)

9:30 PM, November 12, 2007

----------------------------------------------

So, Dean was no better than Dwyer, eh? Sure thing, sport.

If you believe that slop you're as clueless as bubba.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 11:23 AM, November 17, 2007

"Douglas knows he doesn't have to do anything to keep his job. He's kept his options open on clean air, consolidation, and the income tax."

11:12 AM, November 12, 2007

---------------------------------------

Yeah, Douglas is for clean air as long as he doesn't actually have to do anything to make it happen.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 11:47 AM, November 17, 2007

"Jeff said...'

Wow. A little too much caffine this morning?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:19 PM, November 17, 2007

Anonymous said...
"Jeff said...'

Wow. A little too much caffine this morning?

12:19 PM, November 17, 2007

---------------------------------------

Just warmin' up. I just love pullin' the wings off wing-nut flies.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 12:56 PM, November 17, 2007

"Just warmin' up. I just love pullin' the wings off wing-nut flies."

Have you taken yours off yet?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:06 PM, November 17, 2007

Anonymous said...
"Just warmin' up. I just love pullin' the wings off wing-nut flies."

"Have you taken yours off yet?"

1:06 PM, November 17, 2007

--------------------------------------------

Nah, but given the state of you and the rest of the coalition of the clueless wing-nut comp, I'm the only one who could.

I'll keep you posted.

Hey, given the extent of your shtick, I'd want to be one of the 27 other anonymous posters on this board, too.

Always a pleasure.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 1:52 PM, November 17, 2007

"In your future posts, feel free to actually try. It'd be nice to actually break a sweat for a change while I'm breaking the "arguments" of the likes of you.

You can show yourself out."

Yeah, most of know Bubba's a right wing nut. But it's sad that the community college dropout who posted the above boast thinks he's so clever. What's he gonna do when his mother sells the house.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 9:39 PM, November 17, 2007

bubba said...
Something ridiculous.
10:49 AM, November 17, 2007

-----------------------------------------------

In other words, you can't comprehend, debate, dissect his argument factually or lay a glove on him in any way shape or form.

Gee, thanks for clearin' that up.

Why don't you become a lobbyist for Vermont's wing-nuts. I'm sure they'd appreciate it.

Both of 'em.

You're welcome.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 10:16 PM, November 17, 2007

"Why don't you become a lobbyist for Vermont's wing-nuts."

You mean Anthony Pollina? Why would I become a lobbyist for him?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 10:29 PM, November 17, 2007

Doug Hoffer said...
"Except for the last post, not one entry after mine contained ANYTHING of substance related to the subject. So yes, I would have to agree with the person who said there is pervasive anti-intellectualism on this site."

----------------------------------------

I beg to differ, Doug. They're not anti-intellectual. They're merely ignorant and ill-informed idiots.

Moreover, given the fact they lack the capacity to form intent, they're incapable of being American or actively anti-anything.

That said, you can see why they prefer to remain anonymous. I mean, c'mon. Why wouldn't they?

Again, they're merely ignorant, ill-informed, UnAmerican idiots.

Clearly, they're dinosaurs. Let 'em go find themselves a tar pit and fall in it.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 10:33 PM, November 17, 2007

Anonymous said...
"Why don't you become a lobbyist for Vermont's wing-nuts."

"You mean Anthony Pollina? Why would I become a lobbyist for him?"

Nice try, shmendrik.

I wouldn't. You couldn't. On the other hand, Dwyer and McLaughry might be in the market for someone with your disabilities.

Give 'em a call.

Don't mention it. Always happy to help the less fortunate.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 10:41 PM, November 17, 2007

Hey, jwpoop, we love the way you cover for your self-loathing by trying to be brave and clever and self-confident.

And it's funny the way you play the sycophantic Robin to Hoffer's Batman.

What's that? Mom's yelling up the stairs at you to get off the computer and turn the lights out?

Nite, nite!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:12 AM, November 18, 2007

By the way, you were in diapers when McLaughry and Dwyer ran against Dean. I was old enough to vote and I voted for Dean.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:14 AM, November 18, 2007

Is jwpoop really Doug Hoffer's alter ego?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 6:31 AM, November 18, 2007

Anonymous said...
Hey, jwpoop, we love the way you cover for your self-loathing by trying to be brave and clever and self-confident."

As opposed to posting anonymously?

Nice try, nitwit.

Gee, jwpoop, eh? 24 hours and that's the best you and bubba could come up with?

Clearly, I've overestimated you two.

If my spirit ever flags or my confidence ever ebbs, Thank God I've got the likes of you and bubba to restore me.

Always a pleasure.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 8:49 AM, November 18, 2007

Anonymous said...
Only what Mr. Pollina pays him to be an expert on.

9:35 AM, November 17, 2007

-----------------------------------------

Well, whatever he's paying the likes of you to be completely clueless about absolutely everything is money well spent.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 9:35 AM, November 18, 2007

jwcoop, nobody likes a smartypants. But at least the guy you so desperately want to be friends with, Doug Hoffer, fits the full definition of that term. You're just the pants part. You add nothing to the discussion. You're not funny. And you're fourth-grade attempted put downs are amusing only to you. It must be annoying for Doug to have you following him around and tugging at his coattails asking,"can I hang out with you, Mr. Hoffer, pretty please?"

"Always a pleasure."

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 10:25 AM, November 18, 2007

Anonymous said...
"jwcoop, nobody likes a smartypants."

Really? Well, at least that's one problem you'll never have to face.

"But at least the guy you so desperately want to be friends with, Doug Hoffer, fits the full definition of that term. You're just the pants part."

Do tell.

"You add nothing to the discussion. You're not funny. And you're fourth-grade attempted put downs are amusing only to you."

Now that's entertainment.

Discussion, eh? What discussion? It's bubba and a couple of anonymous nitwits like yourself whining about Doug Hoffer.

At least you can whine about me now.

You're welcome.

"It must be annoying for Doug to have you following him around and tugging at his coattails asking,"can I hang out with you, Mr. Hoffer, pretty please?"

Really? At least that's a problem neither one of us will have to face.

Frankly, I don't know they guy, but anybody who's got the likes of you and bubba in such a lather must have something going for him.

He raises some good points. He advocates some positions I agree with, he advocates some I don't.

That aside, agree with him or not, he's informed. You clowns might want to try goin' that route.

Couldn't hurt and I just might break a sweat. Hope springs eternal.

Always a pleasure.

Thanks for saving me the trouble of typing that. You're very thoughtful.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 2:49 PM, November 18, 2007

Pollina all the way!!!!!!!!!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 3:36 PM, November 18, 2007

Anonymous said...
Pollina all the way!!!!!!!!!

Yeah, all the way to another Douglas Victory Party.

Like Hadar in 2000, Pollina can't help. He can only hurt.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 4:21 PM, November 18, 2007

Sounds like SOMEONE'S mommy didn't give him his Ritilen today.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:42 PM, November 18, 2007

Jpoop, I assume you meant to say Nader, not "Hadar."

I agree with you that Pollina will only spoil the race for a Democrat, which is too bad -- not that the Dems are putting up anyone who could beat Douglas anyway.

Aside from the fact that we apparently agree about Pollina's place in Vermont politics, you're still a falsely smug, name-calling boyman.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 7:53 PM, November 18, 2007

Not yet. I'll give 'em until the Holidays - Easter and Opening Day at Fenway. Barring some extraordinary circumstances or events, if they can't beat Douglas in 7 months, they're not gonna beat him in 11 or 12.

If Pollina gets 15 percent and Douglas wins by 9 points or less, he'll know who to thank and we'll know who to blame.

At least Holocaust Survivors for Buchanan won't be a factor.

Either way, if they're going to start running the second the returns are in, they really ought to go to a 4-year term.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 11:11 PM, November 18, 2007

Gee, tough break Kiddo. Ask the lady next door. Maybe she can hook ya up.

Always a pleasure.

# Posted by:

JWCoop10 | 11:14 PM, November 18, 2007

"Gee, tough break Kiddo. Ask the lady next door. Maybe she can hook ya up."

This does not even make sense or relate to any posting.

Always a pleasure.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 8:52 PM, November 19, 2007

When he tosses his hat, does his head go with it?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 5:49 PM, November 21, 2007

The Democrats are not going to beat Douglas this time, or next time, or the time after that, if he decides to run.

With its two-year terms and left-leaning Legislature, Vermonters seem perfectly content to let a moderate sit in the executive's seat until they feel like they've had enough, as Howard Dean did. And they're not too hung up on whether there's a D or an R after their name. Jim Douglas and Howard Dean are not too far apart on most positions.

The extreme left of the Democratic Party, the far right of the GOP, and the Progressives all think their message resonates with far more people than it really does. Listen to Pollina, Paul Beaudry, or John Odum for about 10 minutes and see if you can get the sense they think they're preaching to a much larger choir than they really are. If they really speak for the masses the way they imagine they do, why can't they or their candidates ever get elected?

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 10:39 PM, November 21, 2007

Correct.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 1:31 PM, November 22, 2007

Paul Beaudry would be the norm in pre-70's Vermont but obviously is out of fashion in today's leftist workers' paradise. Just a bunch of old fools reminiscing about the Vermont of family values, patriotism, and love of country. How dated!

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 2:42 PM, November 22, 2007

No, bubba. Beaudry's reactionary dopery was never the norm in VT.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 5:50 PM, November 22, 2007

Douglas: a decent enough guy seems to have turned sour. I do not generally care about party labels (a pox on all their houses), but increasingly I don't like the man.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 10:00 AM, November 23, 2007

Fair enough opinion of Douglas. Douglas has become more sour.

What about a politician becoming even more cynical during the same period?

Would you also agree that Douglas' political counterpart Pete Shumlin has gotten even more cynical since he returned to the Senate? I'm not sure I could think of anything the guy wouldn't do or say for a minor political gain.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:36 PM, November 23, 2007

Paul Beaudry is probably considered a far-right thinker in Vermont; in the real world he is simply a common-sense moderate.

# Posted by:

Anonymous | 12:49 PM, November 23, 2007